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#1: John Macdonald (perlwolf) on Apr 30, 2013

But difficulty without an good resulting image is not so interesting.

Afraid I have to agree with John.

ditto above :(

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I've drawn after a little plate of colour peppers. :)

Unfortunately, Thomas, there are dozens of puzzles that are just patterns with no image. Most of them seem to be done by children who have not developed the skills to make a puzzle with an image. And there are those who are just bored and just make random patches of color.

Thomas... just think if we could have both worlds (pic & puz)

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. . . . . . . . . . . (This is me being quiet.)

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ok maybe that wasn't the best image,I'll do better the next time

I'm sure you will, Thomas. You have a lot of talent. Your puzzles have added interest because they are a bit different.

Thomas, the other people leaving comments here are good puzzle makers. I try once and awhile, but I'm not good at it. You are good. I kindly suggest you listen to the advice of the others--not Karl--but the others in these comments. The advice is meant to be helpful, not hurtful.

Facts: I'm a professional solver, not them. They are makers.
I'm not interested in nice pictures, long stories etc. The only thing is important of making this type: the limits of solvability, because i know very special solving logics, but not yet the absolute limilts.
I know Tetsuya understood it in the 90's. I will, too.
I don't want to make nice puzzles :)

Hi Thomas, I am far more of a solver than a puzzle maker. (I've made a couple of puzzles, but they are not very good.)

As a solver, I especially enjoy a puzzle that engages me on many levels.

Having to use significant logic to figure out the solution is something I appreciate. (I hate puzzles that are trivial fill-ins. On the other hand, I don't like fiddly puzzles - ones where you are only getting one pixel inserted at a time - I prefer a balance of having to find individual key pixels that open up a portion of the solution, etc.)

In addition to placing all the pixels though, the puzzles I like best also have an image that is reasonably recognizable but borderline - so that until you've placed the last few pixels, and maybe not even until you get a hint, it is hard to figure out what the image is supposed to be. The "aha" moment when a collection of vaguely organized pixels suddenly jumps into focus as an specific image is a great enjoyment. Accomplishing this often means fitting the image into a grid of just the right size so that the image can be clearly recognized but only just barely. That (in addition to getting annoyed at large blocks of fiddly non-challenging solution blocks) is a reason that I prefer small and medium sized puzzles. So, to a large extent, I agree with you about puzzles that are "nice" - it is easy to get a pretty picture if you use a large grid and fill in a lot of fine scale details of the image, but that generally tends to trade a creative challenge in the solving for simply a challenge of scale and time.

In another dimension, the title of the puzzle will often provide a similar "aha" moment, when the words of the title which might have many different meanings, or be applicable to many situations suddenly come into focus as to how they apply to the particular image.

So, while I applaud your interest in making puzzles that are challenging the limits of logic for their solution, I would hope that you also explore the other dimensions in which a puzzle can provide an additional challenge and reward to the solvers.

Unfortunately I can comment your loooong opinion in my own language only (great luck you all won't understand):
Aztakurvaéletbe... :))

Well, I had to use google translate to look up "Aztakurvaéletbe" - or even to figure out it was Hungarian. (My Hungarian language knowledge is limited to a few dance names. tanc, czardas, mesoczeggi (that's probably spelled wrong, it's been a long time since I danced that one) and others will come back to me at some point.

I hope you could read it well enough to understand that it is meant kindly.

holy shit life
"aztakurvaéletbe" from Hungarian
This is what I got from Google.

John: tánc, csárdás, mezõszegi. :)
Really I'm not Hungarian (languaged) but living here for a long time. This language is very coloured in special meanings.
From Norma's version holy and shit are false, life is true. :)

How many languages do you speak, Thomas?

What I got from a google search was even ruder than what Norma found. What she got as "holy shit" came out as "wow"; the "life" part was more closely related to the act of attempting to create life. :-)

Lots of people have created puzzles composed of single dots, mainly as solving exercises. They're a good way to hone one's solving skills, but they're also pretty boring.

This puzzle is rated low for quality and difficulty,so why the discussion Thomas,face it,it just sucked. I'm neither a professional solver or creator,I'm just a schmuck who enjoys making puzzles for others to enjoy. Quite a few are highly rated for quality and difficulty and I admit that's just the way they ended up. It's not like I know much logic to be able to plan a puzzle to be some great challenge. I do for the most part try to make sure it's solvable by logic alone,and I use the helper to see if it's too easy,but that's it. So if a schmuck like me can do it,how is it that a "professional solver" like yourself came up with such a piece of shit. Get off your high horse and just go back to making puzzles that people can enjoy. Before this puzzle everything was fine until people tried to give you some constructive criticism,now all of a sudden your some high falutin puzzle solver. I'm sorry everyone,we tried being nice and Thomas just got nasty about it. I've said my piece and now I'll shut up. I hope you can calm down and put an end to this nastiness Thomas. I don't care where your from or where you live now,your just a regular person like the rest of us.:)

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I don't know care how many languages you claim to speak but you can't speak(type) english very well.

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Wow, it looks like Karl's influence has spread to a few others here now. :-)

Thank y'all for trying to be nice to each other ;-)

Lol...I solved this puzzle because it had so many comments. When I was finished I gave it two "1"s because it was not challenging. It was not clever. It was not fun.

If Thomas chooses to continue to create puzzles like these, they just won't get solved by very many people.

Thomas, I hope you make interesting puzzles in the future. I will solve your puzzles two more times. If they are puzzles like this one, I'll stop solving them.

Thomas - If you choose to create puzzles only for your own enjoyment then it really doesn't matter what anyone, including me, thinks about them.

I'm not sure, however, why you would want to publish your creative works here if you don't intend to accept well-reasoned critiques. It is somewhat akin to publishing research for peer review in a scientific journal. We are your peers and these are our reviews.

I'm curious as to whether you solve or view others' puzzles here or only create and publish your own. Much like an entertainer becomes successful, we first learn to appreciate the styles and techniques of others to better hone our own talents.

In short . . . I also think you could create puzzles that are more creative and challenging than this one.

The voice of reason. Thank you, Dave.

I could have written comment # 31.

Cause it's only experiment for trying limits, I'd like to create puzzles containing dots enough to solve. Interesting question how puzzles becoming easier or difficulter using one or more extra datas. The quality of image is not so important in this case.

Then I would suggest you try solving some of the experiments that others have made. Adam may be able to provide a list, or you could try searching for puzzles with "experiment" or "logic" in the title.

OK, I choose to solve the most difficult puzzles.
But... In larger sizes better to solve on paper by pencil, because thr whole can be better seen.
Those I made much more easier. The most important the solvability and the quick check.

good grief, we're going to war over a 10x10...

Tedious is not equivalent to difficulty, either.

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